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GM's Retracted War Dec

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 7 post(s)
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society	Posted - 2010.11.15 04:06:00 - [1] So- enjoying our contracted war dec to punish Fatal Ascension, in its 2nd week, at 11 days, our alliance is issued the typical war-dec cooldown message. It seemed a little odd, and upon looking at the war page in alliance, math shows that it ended 3 days later. Our Executor is issued a refund by a GM, with no reasoning, notice or anything (deposited into his personal wallet and not into the alliance wallet). Both the Executor and my corp CEO have petitioned this to find out exactly why this happened, and so far nothing. Since the dec has ended they have moved billions of ISK out of Jita and the surrounding trade hubs and Gained Sov in 4 systems. Given their safe window (24 hours to cooldown before we can re-dec them plus having someone on to push the button) they have since vanished getting away with what we were charged to prevent them with to begin with. Sure this is EvE, and blah blah blah **** happens, but does this seem strange to anyone else?
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society	Posted - 2010.11.15 04:15:00 - [2] Edited by: Aerion Va''rr on 15/11/2010 04:19:10 Edited by: Aerion Va''rr on 15/11/2010 04:18:53 Originally by: Paul Clavet My advise is to get screenshots of the wallet transactions and in-game notifications. Post them here (for cred, word) and at another non-CCP forum, since things like this tend to fall down the memory hole... Yeah I'm not one with roles to get screenies of the important stuff, Proof will come I'm sure, we delayed posting this to wait for some kind of response from the GM's but like all things, if its not important enough to get answered in the first 24 hours, the received answer is typically BS. All I can post is the original screens of the war-dec notifications, and the retract. DOTLan Alliance Info on FA : Linkage Killboard Campaign: Linkage (it was never reset, as soon as it was retracted, we immediately re-dec'd them as soon as the cooldown ended.)
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 05:18:00 - [3] Originally by: Alara IonStorm Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 15/11/2010 05:13:55 CCP Arkanon Director of Internal Affairs CCP Morpheus Internal Affairs Agent Just incase you were not awhere make sure you EVE Mail these two. They are the Internal Affairs Devs at CCP. One Question: Were you using any kind of new unheard of tactic that could be deamed a future exploit? I know it is unlikely do too the weird GM response but I thought I sould mention it. First Test and now this... Very disconcerting. This is actually a low intensity war-dec, people need to make ISK or something (like Inev's broke ass). By using anything deemed a future exploit.. sitting on 4-4 Undock with sensor boosted pirate cruisers, and insta-locking targets without impunity, otherwise no. Its pretty disheartening really. Hopefully nothing will stop the spanish inquisition.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 05:23:00 - [4] Originally by: NoNah Looks like the wardec preperation time was circumvented by the extended downtime. Which I guess was "forgotten" in the op and following posts. That said, I'm not sure I'd just cancel the war 11 days later. Things would've been so much easier if all timers but skilltraining(or maybe even that) was paused during downtimes - what should've happened is Fatal got their 24 hour warning right after downtime and had their prep time. Might not be the best solution, but hey atleast there's a case. How does the 24 hour warmup (during downtime or not) and 5 days of fighting = ended dec?
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 05:33:00 - [5] Edited by: Aerion Va''rr on 15/11/2010 05:34:50 Originally by: NoNah Originally by: Aerion Va'rr Originally by: NoNah Looks like the wardec preperation time was circumvented by the extended downtime. Which I guess was "forgotten" in the op and following posts. That said, I'm not sure I'd just cancel the war 11 days later. Things would've been so much easier if all timers but skilltraining(or maybe even that) was paused during downtimes - what should've happened is Fatal got their 24 hour warning right after downtime and had their prep time. Might not be the best solution, but hey atleast there's a case. Just asking mate; Honestly I didn't fully understand what you said. My basic understanding of war decs are, I get a message, I get flashies, I have fun. No exploits we're used, attempted, or even newb-attempted during this war. How does the 24 hour warmup (during downtime or not) and 5 days of fighting = ended dec? Never said it was. I said you exploited the fact that there was an extended downtime to gain a noticable advantage. If you noticed what I posted I said this wasn't the best of solutions, but it's not as black and white as implied. Personally I would've prefered seeing your wardec delayed 24 hours, as that didn't happen I'd expect nothing to happen, but I can also see the other end of it. Not going to say it was right or wrong, just pointing the above details out as they're somewhat relevant.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 08:59:00 - [6] Its more of the fact that they got the freighters out thats bothersome, we were paid to disrupt their Empire Operation; and the way this was handled, without even a single word from a GM just doesn't sit right with me, or anyone else in my alliance. While out of our hands, we were denied the ability to do what we were paid to do. I'd say this is something that nobody in the Merc world would tolerate. Unfortunately theres very little we can do about it, except to keep petitioning. Exploits and the like aren't really relevant since our mindset is more along the lines of 'were happy if we get to log in, and press F1'. We don't even have a neut RR army, we don't even use cloaky alts to watch pipes, if we find you and catch you... we're going to kill you. We're going to laugh a bit, and move on.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 13:55:00 - [7] I would at least like a message though to at least the alliance executor or the ceo's saying why the GM's interfered in the first place. Something more transparent then an absent minded dec refund. Originally by: The PitBoss Edited by: The PitBoss on 15/11/2010 13:43:45 Please contact me in-game and let me know what happens If it turns out GMs are hand holding again .. I'll offer my services for free for a couple weeks on them I'm pretty sure Kuroda or Inev will talk to you about this at one point or another, as it stands right now, -FA- will be dec'd for the next several weeks at least.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 15:29:00 - [8] Originally by: Ghoest Originally by: seany1212 This reeks of fishiness, CCP removed the TCUs because sovereignity was being intentionally taken without having to worry about anyone being able to stop it due to the extended downtime, war decs however in my opinion are completely different, going through without being able to be interferred with. The only thing that -FA- missed out on due to it was being able to move assets around eve to there advantage. I hope this GM business is cleared up instead of being swept under the covers Well your right that anything unexplained is fishy - you are wrong otherwise. Its is analogous to exploiting downtime to establish sovereignty. Both are PVP situations where downtime is being used to limit the normal responses an opponent would be allowed to use. For the record, this dec went live a week before, and was extended through the extended downtime, it wasn't pushed through during/before the downtime with any anticipation of 'gaining' an advantage. The situation is, we we're to disrupt their logistics, and deny them access to major trade hubs; the fact that they were able to take SOV in several systems overnight, after a mysterious dec retraction all leaves us rather suspicious. If we would have done something wrong I'm sure we would have heard from the GM's by now. This type of behavior from a GM abusing his powers (clarify: we're not pointing fingers OR accusing anyone) is a smack in the face to all the reputable Mercs in New Eden.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 20:26:00 - [9] Originally by: Lubomir Penev Originally by: Aeir Myiez I can tell you why. 1 member of MI is suspected as being a CCP Dev. Even their own corpies suspect this. Who is MI and how are they related to this story? Militaris Industries, they joined FA a few days into the Dec, and they are the central point for all this drama.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 21:16:00 - [10] Originally by: CCP Morpheus Hi, I'm CCP Morpheus, Internal Affairs Specialist at CCP. There is a paper trail of emails, defects and petitions directly related to this case. Insert vast disappointment here... looking forward to finding out what we did wrong.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 22:26:00 - [11] So- the long and short of our GM Response was... apparently a GM didn't understand that a corporation that we're at war with, joins an alliance, thus making the alliance a wartarget. Without a 24 hour cooldown. So- now, they are going to refund everything lost on both sides, so we get 4 random ships back, and they get all 45 of theirs back...Linkage. We got an apology.....
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 22:57:00 - [12] Originally by: souhyeahright Quote: I have looked into this matter and found that these GM actions were warranted. There is a paper trail of emails, defects and petitions directly related to this case. Would really love to see what that paper trail looks like. I would as well...
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.15 23:24:00 - [13] Edited by: Aerion Va''rr on 15/11/2010 23:25:16 Originally by: Roosterton Originally by: OT Smithers Originally by: Inevitability I not only want to see a paper trail. I want a dev blog explaining this to the ENTIRE community. This error is absolutely unacceptable. Morpheus, Internal Affairs needs to do more than just let this slide by as a mistake. Look at the facts. Fatal Ascension KNEW they were getting into a war with a 24-hour stasis before Militaris Industries was active in their alliance their alliance. I'm sure they knew about this war DAYS before MI even applied to join the alliance. They knew this was coming! Don't play this off! This GM doesn't need to be a GM any longer if he doesn't understand this simple game mechanic. Of course the GM involved knew. He knew he was helping his buddies. I TOO AM A CONSPIRACY THEORIST! Seriously, though, this seems like an ordinary mistake to me. Sure, the GM should apologize and be scolded by his fellow employees, yada yada, but seriously? Accusations like that with no evidence? Theres a 3 Page response from the GMs in my inbox, theres actually evidence, important people have read it. Pretty sure if you actually thumb through the whole thread, we've openly shared information arguing our point. Sorry but I'm not going to post a GM Response on C&P and get this locked and forgotten.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 00:06:00 - [14] Originally by: Raz Lictor The best thing about this thread is the concept that highsec wardecs affect the operations of nullsec alliances beyond killing off morons who are too stupid to have and/or use neutral haulers. It's nice that Violent Intent thinks camping trade hubs is such an inconvenience as to somehow interfere with taking sovereignty. I'm sure that makes them feel important. Come into nullsec and "punish" us if you actually want to have some sort of impact. Obviously its inconvenient enough to whine and petition about. We we're paid to do this, your charismatic presence leaves little to imagine as for the reasoning. Say what you will, but the freighter train that left Jita, the second the dec ended looked to me like we were extremely inconvenient.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 00:19:00 - [15] Originally by: OT Smithers Originally by: Raz Lictor Come into nullsec and "punish" us if you actually want to have some sort of impact. That would sound MUCH more impressive if you were not hiding behind your GM's skirts when you said it. In any case, what impact can anyone have when the GM's will simply reverse your losses. ^ This. Nothings funnier then NC Pets acting hardcore. You we're given space when Ev0ke left. You have a huge history or being pets.. for just about anyone that would take you. If you want to impress someone go out and do it on your own, then talk ****, in the meantime you have the same significance as a Jita Spammer.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 01:14:00 - [16] Originally by: Zagdul Stuff.. 0.0... this is Dotlan sigh... stuff Thanks for the stereotypical "we're in 0.0" response, we know that this war may have minimal impact on you, we know that several freighters made dozens of trips out of Jita the minute the dec dropped, we know, that killing all your morons in Empire is effectively just helping you weed them out anyway. What you keep overlooking..WE WERE PAID TO KILL YOUR IDIOTS. We are enjoying it, I'm glad the GM's decided against reimbursing them at our request (we wern't very happy about all that when it was first mentioned). So I'm sure denying you trade hub access in Empire for however long we feel like doing it won't bother you at all.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 03:38:00 - [17] Edited by: Aerion Va''rr on 16/11/2010 03:44:12 Originally by: Zagdul Why the claims of our gains in 0.0 then? What exactly were you trying to imply? Just sayin'. Your the one that linked DOTlan, you don't know how to view recent SOV changes? Its only minorly coincidental that they happened within the first hours of the dec being retracted. I'm not implying anything other then its just odd. The entire situation just sits really strange with not only me, but just about everyone else as well. Since in all respects you stay in 0.0, we are no threat to your and yours, and you "are not concerned with Empire wars" why do you keep responding since apparently, this doesn't involve you? I'm not the smartest man in the world, but you sure are acting awfully guilty. There really is no proof as of now that there is any foul play, and this could all be one big coincidence; I somehow doubt it though. The GM's already said someone on their team made an error and all they could really do is offer us an apology and say it won't happen again. I'm left with two opinions as to what this whole situation really is... and thats us either giving -FA- entirely to much credit, thinking you can tip the scales in your favor when in all other aspects we've witnessed you guys are pretty fail; Or this is the worst attempt ever at trying to make a bad situation better, and there was a bit of corruption involved. In either case, its distracted me enough. Going to re-divert my attention back to camping your 'idiots' in Empire. Why don't you do them a favor and explain simple things to them, for starters, Remote Sensor Boosters and Machariels (50 Ships later they still don't seem to understand).
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 05:17:00 - [18] Originally by: Zagdul while the rest of us fight off IT Alliance. For the record- we're currently shooting them too. Shame they actually think before they undock, and have a plan. IT has more cap pilots then your alliance has members. Do you have anything meaningful to say? Or are you going to force us to listen to your drivel longer?
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 05:45:00 - [19] Originally by: Zagdul Are you guys like RP'ing mercs or something? Yeah.. To-tally.. like oh my gosh we can't wait to join CVA! ...Moron.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 06:56:00 - [20] Originally by: Hegbard You actually believe that people in 0.0 care enough about your war decs to ask GMs to do something. How cute. You actually think we care about your opinion? This was never about the 0.0 counterpart of FA. Its about the corp we're paid to dec that ran screaming and joined FA. We're not interested in their SOV, Their Caps, Their CTA's or any of that nonsense. It was rather strange how once the dec went cold, Freighters undocked from Jita all day, coincidentally timed about an hour before they started taking SOV in 0.0. We're not interested in 0.0 operations for the last time, We don't care about their SOV. We didn't like having a GM interfere with our War Dec because he perceived it to be a exploit (which it wasn't, and this is paraphrasing a GMs response for all you naysayers). Take your 0.0 PvP Arguments elsewhere, this thread has very little to do with 0.0, and is more in line with questioning WHY our dec was reversed. Why our alliance executor got a partial refund to his personal wallet. Why there was no reasoning, notice or mails from the GM Staff to mention what we may or may not have done. (Moreover- we don't care about your post count, if you don't have anything constructive to say about the original purpose of this thread; by all means redirect your attention elsewhere this forum is full of other meaningless topics you can fill with nonsense.)
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 12:29:00 - [21] Originally by: Mara Rinn Originally by: Aerion Va'rr Theres a 3 Page response from the GMs in my inbox, theres actually evidence, important people have read it. Pretty sure if you actually thumb through the whole thread, we've openly shared information arguing our point. Have you posted that correspondence to some other forum such as SHC? Quote: Edit: They removed their offer to reimburse ships/losses. This at least makes me a little happier about the situation. At least they're not trying to fix the mistake by making another mistake :) SHC?
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.16 13:15:00 - [22] Originally by: Borgh Brainbasher Edited by: Borgh Brainbasher on 16/11/2010 12:51:05 Originally by: Aerion Va'rr SHC? If you don't know it, you prbably shoudn't go there without familiarizing yourself with the locals first. Scrapheap Challenge is a eve-related forum where you can post gm corespondence without ccp-hired mods banning you. But as I said, it has a very...peculiar atmosphere to it. EDIT: too slow, but its the link the guy above me posted Ahh. Well the contents of the discussion with the GMs has been discussed amongst some of the leaders of the Merc industry, I just don't find it appropriate for general public consumption. The GM's are trying to make good with the afflicted side of the ordeal (us) and havn't reimbursed FA or anything (so they say). I've briefly been given the answer I kind of wanted, in the typical manner I expected it. It has been forwarded to the CSM Council though, and they can tear it apart at their leisure.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 00:08:00 - [23] (Reserved- Pending GM Response)
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 01:52:00 - [24] They didn't have anything reimbursed, and CCP Morpheus, isn't the GM currently handling the Petition. I won't comment any further on the GM interactions with this incident, I would encourage you to read the thread (or at least Inevitability and I's responses for a full range as to how this has been handled. The CSM has been contacted, as well as IA and several senior GM's and we're currently waiting for them to address the issue here (as they said they would). I will comment however, that despite all their efforts to deny they petitioned, -FA- has in fact petitioned the war because apparently they didn't understand that accepting a corp with active WarDecs will convert that dec against their entire alliance after said corps 24 hour warm up expires and they actually enter the alliance. This issue actually has NOTHING to do with the extended downtime from what I understand, and more to do with the oversight to 'hazy' war dec mechanics. I realize that alot of whats been said by Inev and Myself might be under scrutiny, but its in response to GM Correspondence not shared on these forums or any other for public consumption (since we don't feel its necessary, nor do I want a EvE-O Ban). I would kindly ask, that any further discussion of this incident, that hasn't read it in its entirety be kept to a minimum pending the response from the Dev Team/GMs. Hopefully this type of incident won't happen again. Cheers C&P, and thanks for all your support.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 13:33:00 - [25] Originally by: Vaal Erit From what I gather you got hit by the GM dork disease in which a GM makes a terribly bad call only to be later overruled by a smarter GM. In this case yes it is quite a terrible thing and you were given a bad deal as that GM did a very wrong thing by canceling your war dec early. However, demanding a public apology and dev blog about this is going over the top. They did something wrong to you so they should apologize to you. CCP should only apologize to the community when it is an issue that affects the community at large (T20/POS exploit/etc) If you think this is the first time a GM has made a mistake then you got another thing coming. Unless you can prove some GM/dev favoritism or involvement as I see it CCP refunds your isk, gives you personally an apology and says that the GM has been dealt with and the situation is over. Asking for some grand apology is unwarranted and unnecessary. We get it, a GM did something dumb...again. Actually- I would say we asked for one, them pulling a dec for whatever reason affects more then just our alliance, but most of the Merc world (and those Griefer types too). The reason it was mentioned, is simply because a senior GM said they would respond to this thread with what happened, why, and how they are going to make it so that when a corp joins an alliance, the alliance gets a similar warmup message with a war, and whom its with. Mynxee and the CSM Reps have been amazingly supportive during this whole situation, and I look forward to reading the notes from the summit. If you think that a wardec getting pulled via petition under false pretenses only affects me and my alliance, well... go back to mining. General Discussion is over there --->
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 15:37:00 - [26] Originally by: Indeterminacy I heard neutral freighterm alts are the new black. Also, why let a formality such as a war dec deflect from what you've been paid to do? You can go into low-sec / 0.0 and kill them for free. Perhaps you'd like to explain why you chose not to? Afterall, disrupting logistics into 0.0 should be easy right especially because FA are ****, etc, etc as you say. It's not like there aren't choke points for you to gank'm. Wait, wait, don't tell me. You just wanted to chill outside 4-4 and get epic killmails courtesy of Charles Darwin himself. You're not actually interested in PVP. Would that be about right? Srs Bzns....I went through a lot of posts and one thing I don't see a record of is a request on FA's part to end the dec via sekrit GM powers. That would be a useful piece of information to see. Otherwise, it's just accusations. You know, I would actually pursure them off the Jita 4-4 Undock, or the Amarr EFA Undock, or FedNavy Station in Dixie.. if they wouldn't keep undocking... by themselves.. untanked.. with billions in cargo. I go where the kills are. Can't do much in lowsec since im exactly -2.0 and don't feel like ratting it up (read: laziness), and well 0.0 has that disadvantage of being a target for.. everyone, considering we've spent the last few weeks killing most 0.0 alliance members, I don't think were on anyones blue list. Like I said, I play how I want to, as do my alliance mates, and for the last time, stop attempting to de-rail this into something as mindless as 0.0 vs Highsec PvP. If you took the time to read this, as many have, you would know that this is all actually based off GM Correspondence, sorry I didn't think you were important enough to discuss it with in detail.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 17:08:00 - [27] Originally by: Detria ^^ This Being a merc, the final outcome of this has a direct impact on how we play the game. High sec wars are our bread and butter and is a large reason why IÆve stuck with EvE for so long. If not handled properly this could set a horrible precedent that could drastically alter the way the game is played for the entire merc / griefer community. That being said, IÆm anxiously awaiting the resolution and applaud the efforts of Violent Intent in pursuing this with professionalism and patience. Seeing Myx involved gives me confidence that this will be handled appropriately. Kill Em All, Dee. Thanks for the support Dee, I along with others from the Merc World will no doubt be attending the Round Table discussions with the CSM on Sunday, anyone else who is a fan of killing people in High-Sec (War-Dec Types) would be encouraged to attend; since the outcome of all of this impacts all of us.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 17:52:00 - [28] Originally by: GM Lelouch There are no indications that the petition filed by Fatal Ascension was created with malicious intent. I am Jack's Smirking Revenge. A personal thank you GM Lelouch and the CSM Council for your time in settling this issue. While unfortunate, I'm glad everything has been reviewed, I'm sure -FA- will enjoy the next few weeks
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 18:51:00 - [29] Originally by: Master Akira Well, color me surprised. An honest GM explanation about a controversial issue with apologies and all. Good job. I must say, I am fully impressed with the GM staff and how they handled this; the public explanation, the in-game mails, everything.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.17 19:33:00 - [30] Originally by: Claire Voyant EVElopedia says "Corporations not currently engaged in any war can apply to join an Alliance." If that is the "bug" in question, shouldn't the corp have been ejected from the Alliance instead of the war being cancelled? Documentation of "the rules" in this game sux. It almost makes me feel sorry for the GMs. Corporations with outgoing wardec's can't join an alliance, Corporations with incoming wardec's can join alliances; which they typically do readily in an attempt to de-rail would be aggressors (that typically rejoice in the newly increase in flashys.)
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.18 00:36:00 - [31] Originally by: Velocity Prime CCP, please give me a job. I could GM circles around your current staff. For real. I fully endorse this message.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.18 05:09:00 - [32] Originally by: Bagehi Ieyasu Originally by: GM Lelouch I'm the GM Test Alliance accepts your apology. Where, aside from multiple de-rail attempts does this thread address anything to do with <TEST> and the removal of TCU's? This isn't CAOD nor is this a <TEST> thread, or even an attempt to discuss what happened to you guys. Go the same route, form your own petitions, and do a similar followthrough; After both a IA and Game Master responded to this thread, I doubt your going to receive any recognition from either party here.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.18 18:36:00 - [33] Originally by: Matt Hock Originally by: Tyburn Stannis As for TEST... gods you really are pathetic attention-***s. Thank you for taking note of our work. We put quite a bit of effort into it, and the acknowledgement that our labors are noticed is always appreciated. Honestly, I don't think most of us give a damn about the TCUs, they were just a troll in the first place and were going to get shot up within a day or two anyway. Heck, I think most of us would agree that the tactic shouldn't be allowed (timers really should pause during downtime imho, but that would require CCP turn some attention away from developing the next shiny new thing toward actually developing a quality product, and we all know they won't do that). The issue at hand wasn't that action was taken, it was that it was handled so poorly by CCP. Pretty much any single factor about the situation being different (the decision favoring IT, history of ignoring it, ignoring every other TCU and just taking down the TEST ones, etc) would likely not have resulted in all the ***ing, but it just kind of ended up the perfect storm of appearance of bias, favoritism, and CCP's standard GM myopia the way they handled it. Oh, and thanks GM Lelouch for apology, etc etc etc :) Petition. (Preferably only one person) Get Response. Repond with "I'd like to escalate this to a Senior GM, and a copy sent to IA so they can track the progress of this petition. ????????? Profit.
Aerion Va'rr Dead Pilots Society Violent Intent	Posted - 2010.11.19 02:55:00 - [34] Edited by: Aerion Va''rr on 19/11/2010 03:02:25 Kill -FA-, Get Paid. Post about killing -FA-, Get Paid. Linkeh \o/
Aerion Va'rr The Priesthood The 0rphanage	Posted - 2010.11.21 00:06:00 - [35] Originally by: Misanth Edited by: Misanth on 19/11/2010 17:12:38 Couldn't be arsed to read past page five. Just had to post a "where's the CSM when you need it.. oh wait lolz?" Edit; Done with the whole thing now. Surprised to see a GM reply with actual content? That's gotta be a first. Hopefully not the last. I still stick with my previous lame joke tho. CSM was supposed to be our internal affairs, took a damn long time before they even responded in this post in the first place - not to mention IA got here first and made both themselves and CSM look like asses. Having both regular GM and a senior GM not understand basic game mechanics just added further fun to this already hilarious thread. Thank you Morpheus, thank you GM #1, Senior GM #2, FA member and CSM for providing us with laughs. Actually Mynxee responded pretty quickly, noone from VI contacted her until the day after (abouts) that this thread was posted; and there were on going talks with GM Lelouch throughout (his responses could actually form a small novel). I'm overly impressed with the GM Staff, the CSM, and community for their support, thanks again guys.
Aerion Va'rr The Priesthood The 0rphanage	Posted - 2010.11.24 03:00:00 - [36] Originally by: Xenuria Deal with it Thank you Xen for once again gracing us with your eloquence and ideals. Why have you NOT died in a fire yet?
Aerion Va'rr The Priesthood The 0rphanage	Posted - 2010.11.25 03:21:00 - [37] Originally by: ectweak Originally by: Hecate Lionfire Grow some balls and get out of your mothers basement. that's mean! can't you see that they're orphans? all jokes aside, even though I've been on the receiving end of the guns of the kids with no parents, I agree that this wasn't entirely thought through on the GM's part. I'm glad for the eventual transparency that was given to us about this, and I can only hope that this level of information sharing will continue in the future. This thread has nothing to do with the 0rphanage (or TEST for that matter), I was in Violent Intent at the time that all this went down; and after some internal turmoil, moved on to bigger and better things. Sorry for the confusion.

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